One of the slipperiest characters in Lioness has long been CIA officer Kyle McManus, played by the talented Thad Luckinbill. Over the course of three seasons, we’ve seen McManus and Lioness Station Chief Joe McNamara (Zoe Saldaña) butt heads as much as work together on various missions to keep their country safe. When McNamara is taken by the Russian operatives, McManus springs into action to find her location and bring her back home—by any means necessary.
Besides the obvious reasons (military intelligence), why is McManus so motivated to find McNamara? “You can tell by the way it’s written—and definitely by the way Zoe and I play it—that there’s a history between Kyle and Joe,” said Thad Luckinbill. Even though “they fight like brother and sister,” Luckinbill points out that the two have “clearly worked together for a long time.” Luckinbill also revealed what creator Taylor Sheridan disclosed to him the source of McNamara’s tension towards McManus. “He told me that Joe has a little bit of resentment towards Kyle because Kyle is all in,” said Luckinbill. “It’s like Joe and Kyle are the same person, but Joe has the weight of her family bringing her down. Kyle’s free to do whatever the hell he’s got to do to get the job done.”
As CIA Deputy Director Byron Westfield’s (Michael Kelly) right-hand man, McManus’ ROE (Rules of Engagement) are different from those of McNamara’s QRF team. The team is shaken after McManus kills a Russian Intelligence Officer to get information about McNamara’s location. “They don’t want to go to jail because of something Kyle did,” explained Luckinbill. “They know he crossed a line.” While Luckinbill acknowledges that McManus knows his actions were “extreme,” McManus also knows what will happen to McNamara if the Russians successfully smuggle her out of the U.S. “He didn’t hesitate to put his own job on the line for a chance at getting her back,” said Luckinbill.
Luckinbill hopped on a Zoom with Decider to discuss Season 3, Episode 4, entitled “Murder Hornets,” praise Sheridan for his knowledge of geopolitics, and more.
DECIDER: I’ve only seen the first 4 episodes, and I’ve been agog at some of the actions Kyle has had to take. Did you receive all the Season 3 scripts at once? What did Taylor tell you about Kyle’s arc this season?
THAD LUCKINBILL: I didn’t receive all the scripts at once. Taylor has so many shows, right? A lot of the time, you’ll get a script and then have to wait a bit for the next one, so it’s like a cliffhanger that you see on the show [laughs]. The cast starts texting each other, going “when’s the next one going to drop?” It’s fun, to be honest.
Taylor pours himself into multiple scripts. I like that I get to focus on one script at a time. Sometimes we’ll get one or two scripts together, but typically it’s just one at a time. I prefer that.
In my eyes, Joe has always treated Kyle as a necessary nuisance. How do you see Kyle’s and Joe’s dynamic?
Clearly, they’ve worked together for a long time. They’re on the same level, right? Prior to the events of Lioness, they’ve had different agendas and missions but have probably helped each other out at times. In Season 1, Kyle comes in and is like, “Hey, Joe, I need some help.” In the past, I’m sure Joe has asked him for a favor or two.
You can tell by the way it’s written—and definitely by the way Zoe and I play it—that there’s a history between Kyle and Joe. They fight like brother and sister. Is there something more to their relationship? We don’t know at this point. I love their dynamic, though. I grew up with older sisters. It’s something that’s very fun for me to play.
Do you think Kyle has a family? What does his home life look like?
Taylor and I have talked about that. I don’t know that there is a concrete answer. I remember Taylor saying to me at one point that the difference between Kyle and Joe is that Joe has a family. She always has her kids and husband in the back of her mind to worry about.
Taylor did say something especially interesting to me this season. He told me that Joe has a little bit of resentment towards Kyle because Kyle is all in. He has committed to his job. He gives 110% at all times. We’ve seen him torture and kill to get the information he needs to be a patriot and help save his country. I thought that was a fascinating juxtaposition between the two characters. It’s like Joe and Kyle are the same person, but Joe has the weight of her family bringing her down. Kyle’s free to do whatever the hell he’s got to do to get the job done.
Obviously, there are some huge moments for Kyle in Episode 4. When questioning two Russian Intelligence Officers, he kills one of them to get Joe’s tail number from the other. I thought I saw a slight hesitation before Kyle executed the man, but now that I’m talking with you, maybe I was wrong?
Kyle did take a second to think about killing that man. It’s pretty extreme to kill a foreign officer on U.S. soil to get needed information. Kyle knows the situation Joe is in right now is dire, and Joe clearly means something to him. He doesn’t hesitate to put his own job on the line for a chance at getting her back.
If you saw some hesitation, it was because Kyle was trying so desperately to get the information without having to kill that man, but at the end of the day, he did what he had to do to get one step closer to finding Joe.
I was shocked at how shaken Bobby and the others were by Kyle’s actions. Even though they’ve never liked each other, there has always been some respect between Bobby and Kyle.
What Kyle did is essentially a violation of the rules of engagement. You can argue that there were special circumstances, but the others don’t want to go to jail because of something Kyle did. They know he crossed a line. Kyle has seen situations similar to this before. The others haven’t. That scene where everybody turns on Kyle was fun for me to play. I loved that.
CIA Special Activities officer Kaitlyn Meade (Nicole Kidman) chastises Kyle in front of the group, but privately supports his actions because they align with his status in the SMU [Special Mission Unit]. Is Kyle Kaitlyn’s right-hand man now that Joe is being held captive?
Yeah, it’s interesting. Zoe and I have discussed our characters’ relationships with Kaitlyn and Byron. Joe is Kaitlyn’s girl, right? To some degree, Kyle answers to Kaitlyn, but he’s more Byron’s guy. They are both CIA. In another season, I hope to see more of Kyle’s and Bryon’s dynamic and learn how they came to work together.
Kyle is always going to operate in the gray. When he killed that guy to get the information they needed, he knew deep down, that he’d be okay. Kaitlyn knows too. He had the correct clearance to get him off the hook.
You have a stunning monologue in which Kyle lays out the worst-case scenario for Joe’s kidnapping in daunting detail. What was your reaction to that scene?
Taylor is so brilliant when it comes to geopolitics. He understands the way the world works. I recently walked away from a conversation I had with him thinking he could be a military advisor in the government. He’s so smart on the way geopolitics works with China and Iran and Russia and the US and the Middle East. He understands how they’re all intertwined in Mexico. He knows all the ways they all have to play together, rely on each other, and work against each other at the same time. His ability to comprehend all that is next level.
He can succinctly put his knowledge into a speech that the audience can understand and that is so fun for us as actors to deliver. We have to set out the global context while making these monologues personal to our characters. Kyle is saying these things while envisioning what might be happening to Joe. There’s a lot of emotion there.
What can you tease—if anything—about the rest of Kyle’s journey this season?
He’ll continue to be relentlessly driven. His attitude towards the Joe situation is a little bit like: “I’ve been there before, and I’ve done it, and I’ll do it again.” I love the design of the character that Taylor created. It’s just really fun to play.
